I’ve been visiting the Horniman Gardens Forest hill for years, but lately it’s going down hill and looking uncharacteristically shabby with broken wooden fence posts and garden gates, graffiti , trampled flower beds, benches moved, even the poor rain soaked sheep are getting quite dirty being forced to sleep on bare concrete in their own mess. Then there’s the irresponsible brainless dog walkers who tottally ignore the numerous ’ keep dogs on the lead ’ signs allowing and even encouraging their eager dogs to hunt, and kill the few remaining squirrels which is not only extreamly distressing to witness its especially terrifying for young children trying to see the squirrel then a dog races up and bites it in front of us as happened twice recently. it is a criminal offence under the Hunting with dogs act 2004 and local park Trust By-laws to worry, injure and kill wildlife including squirrels . So if you are one of these dog owners who flout the law, be warned , wildlife safety, visitor safety and quiet peaceful enjoyment of the gardens is now being reported to the wildlife crime police with evidence . Keep your dog on a lead when entering the gardens. Make sure your dog does not run off from the lower meadow area. Walk your dog across the road in the horniman play park, a much more suitable space for dog walking.
I suggest if you have concerns you contact the Horniman.
Dogs are only allowed off the lead in the exercise area, if people are not doing that they should be challenged.
Sheep are very hardy animals and don’t really have issues with being rain soaked.
In terms of maintainance I have always found the Gardens beautifully kept but remember it had been a rough couple of years, use of the gardens will have increased massively whilst at the same time the Horniman’s income will dropped significantly.
Grey squirrels have natural predators which leads to the inevitable. Although I’d agree it’s not pleasant to witness domestic animals taking on that job, they will be ‘consumed’ anyway as a natural part of the food cycle.
Which part of which animal welfare law or standard are horniman not complying to with the sheep?
I don’t recognise this picture of the Gardens as a regular visitor. It’s autumn so there are a lot of leaves around and fewer flowers. But there have been crates of leaves at the compost heap area so there’s obviously collection going on, the sunken gardens have been replanted and the wilder areas have been trimmed back.
Every time that I’ve walked past the animal enclosure, the sheep have been in the lowest one where there is a shelter for them, even if they don’t choose to use it.
Many of your gripes are, sadly, not the actions of the Horniman but its visitors’ behaviour. I’m not sure what the Horniman can realistically do other than signpost better behaviour. I seem to recall there was a recent job ad for a head groundskeeper, so perhaps they’ve been tight on staff and remedial work hasn’t been as fast as usual. Perhaps it’s on all of us to call out antisocial behaviour if we see it.
I’ve never seen a dog actually catch a squirrel despite chasing them. Though I agree that there are a lot of walkers who disregard the dog walking area, likely with the thought that their dog is such a good boy, that it doesn’t apply. In most instances, their dog isn’t causing any damage or harm so it’s probably not worth the cost of enforcement.
I grew up on a sheep farm. Those sheep are fine.
I have to agree, sheep have heavy woollen coats for a reason, and i’ve never seen a dog fast enough to catch a squirrel.
Horrible for children to see a dog attack anything including rodents such as grey squirrels and I’m not about to defend that.
But rodents such as grey squirrels are disease carriers and grey squirrels are classed as an invasive species and do a lot of damage not only to trees but to also to birdlife. It’s illegal for example to keep or release a grey squirrel back into the wild.
I’m sure the Horniman must have pest control measures in place, though of the “out of sight, out of mind” type as far as park users are concerned.
There are many myths and misinformation demonising Wild Grey squirrels.
Firstly they do not carry zoonotic disease. Grey squirrels do not destroy trees or decimate bird populations, as claimed by haters, ignorant misinformed media brainwashed people and organisations such as defra who have a fanancial insentive using public money to exploit squirrels for species preference and those with hunting interests.
The persecution and Banning of vetinary and care and release Dec 2019 is sencless cruelty in a country that claims to have animal welfare laws. An act condemmed by the rspca.
Grey squirrels were introduced to the UK over 170 years ago by the Aristocracy to enhance the beauty of stately homes parks and gardens along with many other introduced species which you still see today in London Royal parks.
Grey squirrels are also scientificly proven to be one of the best tree regenerating animals as over 30% of the good tree seeds they Bury will grow into new trees if left alone, in doing this they enormously help the biodiversity of plant and animal species in the natural environment and ultimately help combat climate change.
Further to this friendly engagement with grey squirrels has a proven and highly beneficial effect upon wellbeing and recovery of mental illness.
There is no need to cull harmless scapegoated Grey squirrels, their numbers total under a dozen in the entire gardens, hardly an invasion.
My final point, I do not go to a public space to be traumatised by witnessing hunting with dogs by irresponsible people breaking the law for their own selfish amusement causing unnecessary suffering pain and death to these incredible beautiful and helpful creatures. #greysquirrelsmatter 
I’m a neutral in this argument and dare I say all squirrels lives matter but word on the street is the red squirrels are fighting back against this “foreign” Invader…
By natural predetors I assume you mean fox and birds of prey.
The ‘control’ of wildlife in this instance the few remaining grey squirrels at the horniman gardens is not the job of peoples pet dogs, which is illegal in accordance with local authority park order for the control of dogs in public spaces and the governments hunting with dogs law.
The sheep, I would like to see straw bedding provided and adequate protection from wind and rain. The black alpaca died of cold during the last harsh winter. The horniman needs to address these issues and make improvements to ensure the safety and well-being of the Wildlife, animals and the right for peacefull people to enjoy the gardens without fear and disruption. I would suggest that dogs are kept on a lead throughout the gardens, with off lead dog walking across the road in the horniman play park.
The Alpaca had been ill for a while, I don’t think it died of cold. It wasn’t even a particularly harsh winter last year.
You are making a number of accusations here about the Horniman and the animals that live in their gardens. If you have real concerns I suggest you approach them directly.
This post was flagged and is temporarily hidden.
Peep the Alpaca died at the ripe old age of around 16, a decent age for an alpaca. After being unwell for some time according to Horniman. The idea that she died of the cold is unlikely, given the mild climate here compared to harsh conditions in the Andes which alpacas commonly manage. Perhaps you have some evidence, or are you simply trying to trash the Horniman for some reason?
Umm not sure why you are replying to me - I have expressed no views on grey squirrels.
I am not trying to trash the horniman and find that suggestion offensive. I love the horniman gardens and have expressed concerns about squirrels being hunted by irresponsible dog owners allowing their dogs to hunt wildlife in the horniman gardens.
On the alpaca, I was actually told by a member of the Animals enclosure staff that it died off the cold winter conditions!
What about:
Like others have indicated above, I’m not sure I recognise the way you are describing things, although I would also agree that the last year will have been trying for the organisation, given likely pandemic-related funding shortfalls.
I am sorry for my choice of words and I meant no offence. But I genuinely did read some of your remarks as a series of pot shots at the Horniman, who are unlikely to respond on this forum. As others have suggested accusations about their animal management and attitude to wildlife are probably best taken up with them.
Tyes that reply to you was supposed to go to troy mcclure