Smart Benches in Forest Hill - what do you think?

Streetscape
#51

Thanks to all who have contributed. This will certainly not happen if people don’t see benefit and don’t want it.

I will talk to some school kids and I will visit the bench in Lewisham during this summer.

Some questions on the thread are valid, so I will ask powers that be to address them. (Vandalism, maintenance, security, technology obsolescence and cost)

Apologies for drip feeding information but below are other suggested destinations. Some of the places could do with a bench so having extra bits on it may not harm.

IMG_0119.JPG4160×2340 1.59 MB

Not really sure how it fits with other benches. Clutter comes to mind if in front of the pool.

And other proposed sites

I will feed in other locations suggested, but that will be decision for Perry Vale ward (Mayow Park, inglamere rd)

Lastly, we can include this as an item on the next assembly (Saturday 23rd September) and have views of people who have not seen it here.

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#52

I’m all for it if location works @MajaHilton though not necessarily what I suggested. I think the kids would love this as opposed to us oldies deciding on this & lets face it, they are our future generations so we should listen to them :slight_smile:

#53

I think School kids should be able to voice opinions on this, so appreciate your comment here.

#54

@MajaHilton. The article in the first post, and then your subsequent picture a few posts ago show two different benches. Are there design choices? The first seem more appropriate to a modern town centre like Lewisham. IMHO the second one isn’t that bad from a design perspective.

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#55

@anon5422159 I want to create a ndw topic linked from this one. How do I do that?

#56

Please see instructions here. It’s not obvious unfortunately - I’ll see if I can put a better UI proposal to the developers.

#57

I believe its just the two pics are from a different perspective?

#58

Pic 1.

Pic 2

image.jpg436×603 167 KB

So no.

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#59

Oh sorry I had looked at all the various pics on the web for the Strawberry benches and they all looked the same a sort of plank combo?

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#60

Hi @starman yes there are design choices. Those two. I can ask for more photos if needed.

I did visit Lewisham bench and over 30 min I observed it (totally random). There were 4 people sitting on it at all times. Two men were heavily into their phones (one typing at times, one having an earpiece possibly listening to music). One lady was charging her phone while playing a game. Another man just was simply using it as a bench. Others sat down for 5 min and went. None of them could be described as teenagers(one was a small child). What was interesting is that people were happy in sharing the space while a nearby bench was empty. I spoke to the lady (who was charging her phone) and she thought the bench was great. She has heard about additional pocket chargers, but was not that keen on them. She was unaware of wifi of who the sponsor was. I did not ask about air quality monitoring? I will go again.

Vandalism was an issue as charge leads were not present. Also the bench design meant that the pavement under it is not easily swept( Second design seems not to have that problem)

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#61

This sounds like a great idea. A couple of my friends from the Far East have commented on how ridiculously far behind London is with public wifi access.

Free wifi in shops / cafes simply does not count, as you have to be a paying customer (which teenagers and students usually can’t afford), and don’t work half the time anyway.

We should also be building more public seating areas encouraging people to stop and relax, rather than always rushing between the shops, the station and our homes.

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Parklets
#62

I am the council officer working with Strawberry Energy on the smart benches.

It has been very interesting to see the views set out here and I welcome the various suggestions. Cllr Hilton identified a number of questions raised and I will attempt to answer them - apologies in advance if I miss anything out, feel free to come back to me.

Data security / misuse
The chargers on the benches only provide power and cannot carry data.
The bench collects data on the number and duration of charges but no personal data is collected that can relate to this.

To access the wifi users are asked to provide some personal data including name, email and age range. Strawberry Energy’s website sets out the terms under which this data is collected. This commits Strawberry Energy to the use of data in line with the Data Protection Act 1998 and that they will not sell or share personally identifiable information with third parties.

What happens if the benches become obsolete?

This is some information Strawberry Energy has given me:
“The Smart Benches are conceived as upgradable smart platforms. We can easily upgrade it with new features and technologies and can change the hardware to respond to changing technology or demand from consumers.”

How are the benches maintained. And what happens if the funder goes bankrupt?

The benches are maintained for free under the terms of a wayleave agreement covering 10 years that grants permission for the benches to be installed on Council land.

If the company goes bankrupt then there is a risk that future maintenance or removal of the benches falls to the Council. The only no-risk approach is not to have any benches.

What is the value of the benches?

This is commercially confidential, but my understanding is that similar designs have been purchased for around £6,000.

Is there a problem cleaning underneath the benches?

Strawberry Energy acknowledge that there have been occasions when the existing benches have had debris trapped underneath them and are taking steps to amend their regular maintenance to address this. They note that when their maintenance crew clean the bench they also clean the surrounding area and will take particular attention to the space beneath the benches.

Security

A number of people have raised concerns that the benches could become targets for phone thefts. Given the widespread use of mobile devices in public places the installation of benches may not increase crimes of this type, although I recognise that they could become a focus for this. We are monitoring the use of the existing benches and thankfully so far no incidents have been reported. Again the only no-risk approach is not to have any benches.

I hope this covers points that people have raised and sorry for the lengthy post. As Cllr Hilton has said Strawberry Energy has proposed a number of locations in Forest Hill. These are currently being reviewed by service teams in the council to identify any potential issues and we will then seek wider views by placing a notice in each location and asking local groups such as the local assembly for input. Happy to flag up on here when we are moving forward on this.

As I am not too sure whether people automatically see posts they have expressed a view on I thought it might be helpful if I tag people who have commented on the issues above (apologies if this is not helpful).
@RachaelDunlop @Pauline @starman @Wynell @anon5422159 @Londondrz @MajaHilton

Also forgive my selection of username, I can assure you my powers are very limited. :slightly_smiling_face:

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#63

@thepowersthatbe thanks for that thorough and informative update :+1: It’s excellent to see the council engaging with local residents like this.

From my PoV, my concerns are addressed by your points.

Looking forward to further updates on the smart bench rollout in SE23.

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#64

A post was split to a new topic: Parklets with permission via PM from @kat.standlake.point

#65

I was at Forest Hill Pool this week, and thinking that the environment around the front entrance - shrubbery and benches - was very nice. I don’t think enabling people to use WiFi there would improve the situation. There is WiFi in the Library and in many cafes, and the internet is available via mobile phones … nice to have some spaces without electronic paraphernalia.

Maybe the next innovation will be cafes and other venues that are able to block phone and WiFi signals. I think digital detox could be a big selling point.

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#66

I must admit, I agree with everything you are saying. I like the idea to charge phones while seating on the bench and the actual bench itself, dont particularly like adverts and dont see much need in WiFi (nowday phone contracts come with good data allowences) . As rightly somebody pointed out in the earlier posts, people have to stop rushing and benches are perfect opportunity to take time to relax. Ideally I would love to see lots of parklets across London where people can stop to rest. But unfortunately the only option available is to have benches with technology and adverts, I dont see Councils introducing just benches cause of the costs to make them and maintain them. It is sad indeed.

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#67

In Islington, 4 of the 5 benches that were installed have been ordered to be removed:

after planning permission was applied for retrospectively (the benches were installed with no PP in place). 4 of the applications were refused because they were in conservation areas.

There were also concerns from the police where the benches were close to the road, in an area known for phone snatches by bike riders.

Planning report:

http://planning.islington.gov.uk/NorthgatePublicDocs/00438158.pdf

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#68

Hi @blushingsnail my understanding is that Islington Council are still working with Strawberry Energy who are relocating the benches that have been removed in alternative locations at Strawberry Energy’s expense.

In Lewisham the smart benches have been installed following consultation with planning, community safety and a number of other service teams. Any locations where concerns have been identified either by Council teams, or by responses from the public to notices put up in possible locations, have been rejected. The benches are considered to be permitted development by the Council’s planning service but each location is reviewed on a case by case basis paying particular attention to any local circumstances such as existing design of public space and conservation areas.

Hope this is of interest.

Martin

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#69

Have locations in SE23 been confirmed then?

#70

Hi @starman

A second phase of 5 sites for smart benches in Lewisham has been agreed, these benches are in Catford (Broadway), Evelyn (Sayes Court), Sydenham (Queensthorpe Road), Bellingham (Bell Green) and Brockley (Lewisham Way).

As you can tell from the above I am working on wards rather than postcodes, so apologies if that isn’t quite what you are after.

We had looked at a bench near Forest Hill pool but concerns were raised that this might not fit with the existing design of this area.

Once the second phase of benches has been installed, which should be in the next couple of weeks, I will look to consult on a third phase of possible locations, including a number of sites in Forest Hill. I am happy to update SE23 Life on this as it happens.

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